The Angel with the Gospel

dedication · Posted: Sun Jun 16, 2002 12:46 am Post subject:

O.K. I went back and read the quote more carefully. It did get into the concept of Satan, controlling the minds of men--and making it appear he's an angel of light, more than an angel literally appearing in the skies.

However, I do see the "timing" as to when these messages were first given as being relevant. God sent those messages into the world in a way that really made an impact on people. The word got around, in the news, in the churches, people were made aware of the first angel's message-- albeit Miller thought the "sanctuary" to be cleansed, was this earth, by fire. And he thought the "hour of His judgment" was the executive judgment---
The first angel was announcing the Investigative judgment.
The first angel's message COULD NOT be the end of all things, for two more messages were to follow.

Yet, it was given by people who were totally convinced, not by literal angels, but by Biblical knowledge. They gave a "loud warning", and they also searched their hearts and lives to make all things right with God.

Now we know from Rev. 18 that these messages go out with great force again. Looking back to how it happened in the past, I believe God's people will be placed in a position where they are TOTALLY CONVINCED of the truth, and give it with such earnestness, and sincerity that people will listen!

The message will make the news, it will be on the radio, TV, etc. (and not just on the "religious" channels
And people will be brought to a point where they will listen as the conditions of the world and the message intersect and demand decision.

Eugene Shubert · Posted: Sun Jun 16, 2002 1:07 am Post subject:

Dedication,

RedAngel seems to be saying that no human knows the gospel and that we have no basis to recognize the truth gospel, even if we heard it. The Bible is not the standard of truth. Somehow, we’ll recognize the true gospel as being from God if literal angels are preaching it. She seems locked into the idea that the prophecy must be fulfilled by literal angels.

dedication · Posted: Sun Jun 16, 2002 8:14 pm Post subject:

If that is true, then her theory does leave her wide open for the deceptions coming upon the earth.

For the beast deceives the people with miracles and signs and wonders. (Rev. 13)

It will be a time when we won't be able to trust our senses-- ONLY a solid understanding of scripture will be our anchor.

Jerry · Posted: Sun Jun 30, 2002 8:36 pm Post subject: Everlasting Gospel

In the last message it was commented that believing that an angel will bring the true gospel to earth leaves one open for deception. I have an addition comment and a set of questions for Red Angel if he/she is still monitoring this post.

1) Please identify the "Everlasting Gospel" that you speak of. If the Gospel is "Everlasting" then wouldn't it be here, now? Christ and the apostles always pointed to the Old Testament scriptures to prove their points that Jesus of Nazareth was foretold and then the apostles witnessed that the plan of salvation was fullfilled with the death and resurrection of Jesus.
2) If we are waiting on the true gospel, then wouldn't that mean that our God, the Creator of the Universe, is so impotent that He is not able to maintain His true Gospel message on earth to be learned and followed by mankind?
3) If one claims that what we know as The Gospel, which is the redemptive plan of our God, is corrupt, then how does one know that what you hear from some unidentified angel is not corrupt when you hear it? Is the angel delivering the true message? Did you hear it yourself?
4) What about the caution to not accept another gospel, even if an angel delivers it?

Your thoughts?
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May God bless and keep you.
Jerry

Ian MacLennan · Posted: Wed Jul 31, 2002 11:03 pm Post subject: inerrancy of scripture?

Hi!

Based on other postings on this topic, I see a trend towards denying the reliability of scripture. If you are going to say that the gospel that we have today is corrupt, you are saying that the scripture that we have today is corrupt. This thought scares me.

I got the impression that someone was suggesting we not worry about sharing the gospel because the one we have is corrupt. This sounds like me a lack of desire to step up to the great commission. If you are worried about our gospel being corrupt, then are you not yourself worried about your salvation? I will not argue that the church in its form today frequently falls short of the glory of God, but that very thing is said in scripture! If we just sit and wait for an angel to come and share the gospel, how many opportunities are we missing to share the greatest news we have ever heard?

RedAngel · child of God Joined: 09 Apr 2002 Posts: 24

I've been away for a bit, but upon seeing that there is some interest in my forum topic AND that some have misrepresented what I have said - I shall endeavour to reply soon, in more detail.
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RedAngel · child of God Joined: 09 Apr 2002 Posts: 24

Matthew 24 tells us that the gospel of the kingdom needs to be preached in all the world before the Second Coming of Jesus. We know that the gospel was known to the Old Testament prophets and Israelites, and that the New Testament prophets and apostles also knew and preached the gospel. These same apostles and prophets also were well aware that the gospel/truth would be distorted. Divisions would occur through pride and false doctrines being taught. Even Daniel knew that there would be changes in the kingdom of God that Jesus had established, because he says that “in the days of these kings shall the God of heaven set up a kingdom, which shall never be destroyed; and the kingdom shall not be left to other people” Too many today have consigned themselves to believe that ‘the church’ is the conglomeration of denominations with all their various ideas on the gospel, or on Jesus, or on faith or baptism etc etc. THE church of Jesus was never meant to accept the changes or philosophies that crept in. It then becomes the church of Peter, or of Augustine, or the Church of Benny. The church that Jesus built was true, but people changed it – and it was prophecied to happen. The kingdom that will be established in the last days is also true. But all those churches in the middle……

My point about the gospel today is that the basic message of Jesus may still be preached in all the world, as we believe we are doing, but, it is really “the gospel of the kingdom”? Is it really the same as what Jesus taught when He was on earth? I believe not, based on the various references that talk about the angel coming to bring the gospel, the kingdom being again set up by the God of heaven, and the many references to an apostasy from the word of God. Perhaps “the gospel” is not just a message that Jesus was born, died for our sins, and was raised up again. In fact as I write this now, many variations of these elements come to mind. Many people teach things contrary in these elements.

So what then is the gospel?

And when is it to be restored? It is most surely in the “last days”. But is this really important? Well sure it is. It is really important so that we can know where and when to look. However I believe that it has already occured. I like the before 1844, bit later and after 1844 theory. Dedication where did you get these dates?

Literal Angels vs People??
I prefer to agree with the Bible’s description of ‘angels’. If the Rev 14:6 angel comes from the sky, then is there hesitancy to accept this? If God can move mountains, part the seas, calm waves and heal lepers, then it is easy to accept that angels can come to earth. Just because the NT warns us about Satan deceiving ‘almost’ the very elect, or that there are false prophets it should not weaken our resolve to listen to God’s word from whatever source. I think it is a real shame when people put God in a box and say that He cannot or won’t anymore speak to us from heaven or via angels. It doesn’t say this in the Bible? So is it scare tactics or fear or lack of faith that is promoting the limitations of the God of heaven.

I need to correct some things that were misrespresented by what I said.
1) I did not say that no human knows the gospel
2) I did not say that we have no basis for recognizing the truth (though I do believe that false prophets and ministers are misleading people about how to recognize the truth, so that more and more people don’t recognize it)
3) I do not believe my theory means being left wide open for deception. Because….. God never said that His angels or servants or prophets would NOT be on the earth in the last days. He did say, beware of them, and IF it were possible even the very elect would be deceived. BUT the very elect won’t be deceived. Everyone who refuses to consider that angels can work for God these days, is putting up a wall between themselves and heaven. The very elect will listen.

Jerry Thanks for the questions. I’ll return again when I’ve digested them.
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RonA · Seventh-day Adventist Joined: 19 Jan 2003 Posts: 17

Are the three angels literally going to proclaim their message? The book of Revelation is filled with symbols which stand for actual things. But to suppose that LITERAL angels will be flying around the earth spreading a last day warning message is unbiblical and does not follow the pattern of Revelation. It would be better to say that the "remnant" who have the faith of Jesus and keep God's commandments will be the ones actually carrying out the message of the angels here on earth.

RedAngel · child of God Joined: 09 Apr 2002 Posts: 24

Actually, Revelations 14:6 does say that an angel would fly and deliver the gospel to be preached to all the world.

I wonder what makes you thinks that angels delivering God's message(s) is not biblical? As I recall Jacob, Moses, Mary, Joseph, Abraham, all received witnesses from divine beings. And Moses, Elijah and Gabriel were the names of some of those characters.

So it seems quite in keeping with the pattern that God has previously set before us in the Bible, to have an angel(s) deliver the most important message we could know - the gospel. However, it would seem that the message of the gospel that most people accept must NOT be correct enough,in order for the God of heaven to deliver the everlasting gospel to us in the last days.
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RonA · Seventh-day Adventist Joined: 19 Jan 2003 Posts: 17

You fail to understand that the book of Revelation is not to be taken LITERALLY when you read about seven headed beasts, dragons, angels, harlots, and men with lion like bodies. These are ALL symbols of actual things, religous powers or events. Of course God used angels in the OT to speak to men. But now God speaks to us through his word and through the writings of Ellen White in these last days. The three angels in Revelation 14 symbolize that God will bring about a proclamation of who he is and judgment BEFORE Christ's return. The angels are also pictured concerning the seven trumpets, the seven vials and the seven plagues. But the angels are only SYMBOLS of what God HIMSELF will cause to be upon the earth. You fail to accept the symbolism of the book of Revelation.

garrettms1 · Posted: Sat Jun 21, 2003 10:39 pm Post subject:

the 1st angels message already happened at or shortly after 1844-im not sure-and it wasnt a literal angel-so y would the others be literal angels