Here's the problem. I don't know if any of you have noticed this before. Here's the text of Revelation 13 L

And I saw a beast coming out of the sea. He had ten horns and seven heads, with ten crowns on his horns, and on each head a blasphemous name. 2The beast I saw resembled a leopard, but had feet like those of a bear and a mouth like that of a lion. The dragon gave the beast his power and his throne and great authority. 3One of the heads of the beast seemed to have had a fatal wound, but the fatal wound had been healed. The whole world was astonished and followed the beast. 4Men worshiped the dragon because he had given authority to the beast, and they also worshiped the beast and asked, "Who is like the beast? Who can make war against him?"
5The beast was given a mouth to utter proud words and blasphemies and to exercise his authority for forty-two months. 6He opened his mouth to blaspheme God, and to slander his name and his dwelling place and those who live in heaven. 7He was given power to make war against the saints and to conquer them. And he was given authority over every tribe, people, language and nation. 8All inhabitants of the earth will worship the beast—all whose names have not been written in the book of life belonging to the Lamb that was slain from the creation of the world.

Here's the problem I see with the current iterpretation and kind of throws everything into a flux. Papal rome does fit the description of Daniel and Revelation... BUT the sequence of the events is out of order. You can see that when John sees the beastm he does not see it receiving the wound. He sees the beast as though he already had a wound and it was healed. AND THEN the power was given to him to excercise his authority for 42 months! So, althought 48 months until Napoleon's general excile fits fine, but you see that the beast stil has the power and authority and the time is well beyond the 42 months.

So you can look at it several ways:

1) John presents events waaaay out of sequence in 1 paragraph and it is fine because the events do not have to be in sequence to get across the symbolism. 48 months is part of beast's authority until he receives the fatal wound... and then he gets another part of his authority until Christ comes (which does fit with Daniel)

2) Something wrong with the interpretation and the sequence of the events needs to be take into consideration. Making a doctrine based on assumption about this matter is pretty dangerous because if one is wrong then he will be deceived thinking that he knows the truth.

Which brings me to the next point. Does Bible commands us to be so engulfed in Revelation studies that we know without a shadow of a dobt the sequence of the last events? I mean, saing that VICARIUS FELI DEI is 666 is a bit stretch to find something to fit the description it seems to me. I realize that the Papacy right now is #1 candidate for the beast of revelation... but is it the ONLY candidate? Could we be wrong? If Satan knows what we believe, can he use our doctrine against us?

Here's another problem that I've just realized we have.

A quote from http://www.phillipssda.com/structure.asp and some other GC web cites state the following!


"The General Conference is the highest earthly authority for the Church."

This is a bit chilling for me to discover! This is what I wound expect from to read on the Vatican web site! Do you guys believe this? Just want to make sure. The statement above should read " Word of God - Bible - is the highest earthly authority for the Church!" It's easy to control the Church by controlling the hierirchy. That's what devil has done with Rome and what makes you think he can't do it with SDAs? Just a thought.

BTW from the construction of the Dome of Rock by Abd el-Malik in 688... to beginning of the new secular state of Israel is exactly 1260 years :). I'm not quite sure what it means, but I'm sure it fits in somehow.

Does anyone have anything to say on this issue? Is there a discreptancy on iterpretation or not in your opinion? I'm seeking truth just like the rest of you. So why such silence?

Hi aarkhipov,

I disagree with your interpretation. I see Revelation 13:1-3 as being in chronological order and spanning the entire history of the beast:


I then see the verses that follow as merely giving greater detail to that introduction. For instance, I interpret Revelation 13:4 as a commentary on the universal acceptance of the beast throughout the Medieval Church age:


It is easy to see how that was already fulfilled:

"The people were wholly deceived. They were taught that the popes and priests were Christ's representatives, when in fact they were the representatives of Satan, and those who bowed to them worshiped Satan. The people called for the Bible; but the priests considered it dangerous to let them have it to read for themselves, lest they should become enlightened and expose the sins of their leaders. The people were taught to receive every word from these deceivers as from the mouth of God. They held that power over the mind which God alone should hold. If any dared to follow their own convictions, the same hate which Satan and the Jews exercised toward Jesus would be kindled against them, and those in authority would thirst for their blood." Early Writings, p. 214.

Thank you for your input.

Officially, Seventh-day Adventist no longer believe or teach that the title Vicarius Filii Dei is inscribed on the pope's tiara. The reason is a good one. Adventist scholars now freely admit that there is no credible, verifiable evidence to substantiate this traditional Adventist belief. See http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vicarius_Filii_Dei


You are right to be chilled by that statement. It would be even more chilling to find a Seventh-day Adventist that really believes that the General Conference has greater authority than the Bible. I don't think that that is what they really mean. I think that Adventists simply mean that when the General Conference is in full session, that their administrative decisions are binding on the whole Adventist Church.


I don't think that you have anything solid there at all as far as Bible prophecy is concerned. You also made a reference to 48 months. Where did that come from?

Eugene,

Thank you for clarifying these. I meant 42 months (or 1260 years). That was typo.

What do you think the number of the beasts name is? Are you familiar with any work of Alexander Hislop. Although some people concider his research to be a figment of imagination, I think it makes much sence. Especially explanation of 666 and how it ties to the issue of Sun worship. Hislop is not SDA and it is encouraging to find some outside of church evidence that connects 666 and Sun worship. Nevertheless, I am not trying to be mean spirited. Just seeking the truth and asking questions.

I think the number of the beast is 666.


I am one of those persons:



In mythology Saturn is father of the gods but it's unreasonable to say that the word Saturn is the name of the beast.

What I'm talking about is not Saturn, but the Astrological beliefs of the Ancient Babylonians. The ZOdiac system essentially encodes 666 into Sun worship. I believe that calculating means essentially that... calculating. There is no refference to alphanumerics in Bible.

12 signs (Gods) of zodiac were assigned each into a 3 chambers. The chambers were given a number (1-36). The sum of all is the number of the sun. The 6x6 magic squares indeed were discovered that arrange numbers so that any row or column would add up to 111. So the sum of all numbers is 666. Interestingly enough Semiramis (whether you believe it or not) played a great role in origin of such religious system... and she just happened to be a whore .... of Babylon. So John obviously was trying to convey something here. Somehow the 666 is connected to sun worship. Weather Hislop is right or wrong there's no way of knowing unfortunatly. But his alleged discoveries do make sence, both historically and theologically.

As far as my question : what do you think the NUMBER OF BEST'S NAME is? What I meant to ask ... how do YOU calculate the name of Papacy to be 666?

I was responding to to Alexander Hislop's view of 666, which you seemed to support.


To answer that in greater detail, I refer you to Alexander Hislop's book The Two Babylons, Chapter VII, Section V, titled, The Name of the Beast, the Number of His Name-- The Invisible Head of the Papacy. There, Alexander Hislop explains that the Pope is the legitimate representative of Saturn and the sum of the numerals of the name Saturn add up to 666.


I don't think so.


The sum is 666 but I disagree that the SUM refers to the SUN.


I don't believe that the Babylonians discovered any 6x6 magic square. I think that's an Adventist myth, published in ancient Adventist books and everywhere on the internet but with no archeological support.


It's easy to recognize the truth when you see it.


My answer to that question requires a full chapter of careful writing. I can't give away any of the details now. I have agreed to include my unique explanation of 666 in a short commentary on the book of Revelation that I plan on writing together with the founder of the Come To Christ Ministry. I don't know when our joint project will begin. Grace is very busy with her own full-time gospel witness and she doesn't even have time to write up the many wonderful things that the Lord is teaching her almost daily.

Dear aarkhipov,
I agree. The composit beast of Rev 13 has not risen out of the sea yet.

Some folks think this is the same ten-horned beast Daniel saw. No so. When this prophecy is fulfilled, you will be amazed at its accuracy. The whole world has not yet wondered after the beast. This beast has not yet raised its ugly head. How do I know? In verse 3 John tells us that one of the heads seemed to have had a deadly wound, but that the wound had been healed. What has always gone over most folks' head is the realization that at the time John sees this beast ascend, the wound had already been healed! In English we call this past perfect tense. You will agree that the first beast of Revelation 13 does not come into view until after the deadly wound is healed.

Let’s review:
The deadly wound was inflicted in 1798. In that year Breathier, one of Napoleon's generals, took the French army to Rome, made the Bishop of Rome, Pope Pius VI prisoner, and carried him to France where he died. The civil power of the Papacy finally ceased and a republic was set up in Rome. So, that means that the seven headed ten horned beast does not appear until after 1798. Are you with me? But that is when the deadly would was inflicted. The text says that the wound had been healed. Looks like we still have a little historical research to do. What do you know about the healing of the wound? In February, 1929, the Lateran Treaty was signed with Benito Mussolini granting the wounded church 110 acres to be know as Vatican City State, placing it above and not subject to the lawful Italian Government. Theologians call this the healing of the wound. This means that the seven headed ten horned beast does not appear until sometime after 1929.

Ps 73:22: I was stupid and ignorant, I was like a beast toward thee.

2 Pet 2:12: But these, as natural brute beasts, made to be taken and destroyed, speak evil of the things that they understand not; and shall utterly perish in their own corruption;

Jude 10: But these speak evil of those things which they know not: but what they know naturally, as brute beasts, in those things they corrupt themselves.

Has anyone considered the beast of Revelataion 13 is describing our "old man" - pride (lion); unchanging attitude (bear); sin-nature (leopard).

Yes. This was the favorite pet theory of an elder at the Point Loma Seventh-day Adventist church many years ago. He was always saying of himself, "I am the beast." I would always think to myself, "O brother, prophecy is not of private interpretation. If you are the beast and claim to be a Christian, then shouldn't you be also interpreting the whole context of Revelation 12 and 13?" I never took him seriously and thought of him as an arrogant clown that was always mocking true humility in his absurd heresy. I never heard from others or ever got the impression from him that he claimed to understand Revelation 12 and 13. I thought that he was always saying, "I am the beast" for the shock value of that phrase just to get attention.

When I realized Jesus only taught in parables (Mt 13:34; Mk 4:34), I began to think that it was a hint as to how we were to interpret scripture. It is amazing how this opens the Bible to a new level. Most scoff at the idea.

For instance: In Rev 9 we have scorpions with stings in their tails. Eze 2:6 refers to scorpions as rebellious people. Isa 9:15 refers to a tail as a false prophet. Revelation is a book of symbols. At first it looks easy to understand, but in reality, the Spirit has to show one, in order to grasp the point of a prophecy.

Likely, Rev 13 is about those who never move away from being a beast (in type of course), and pride still rules their lives.

It’s settled then. When God reveals the meaning of the book of Revelation to you as He has to me, then you will be sufficiently competent to explain it correctly. Until then, if ever, and obviously at this moment, you don’t grasp any sense of the meaningful context of the prophecy.

Rev 13:1. And I stood upon the sand of the sea, and saw a beast rise up out of the sea, having seven heads and ten horns, and upon his horns ten crowns, and upon his heads the name of blasphemy.
2. And the beast which I saw was like unto a leopard, and his feet were as the feet of a bear, and his mouth as the mouth of a lion: and the dragon gave him his power, and his seat, and great authority.
3. And I saw one of his heads as it were wounded to death; and his deadly wound was healed: and all the world wondered after the beast.
4. And they worshipped the dragon which gave power unto the beast: and they worshipped the beast, saying, Who is like unto the beast? who is able to make war with him?