Mel Gibson and The Marian Agenda

dedication · Posted: Sun Feb 29, 2004 6:29 pm Post subject:

Several years ago, I read the book "Thunder of Justice", a catholic book by Ted and Maureen Flynn, about endtimes according to the Marian agenda.

Here is a study [URL=http://dedication.www3.50megs.com/mary.html]
The Real and the Counterfeit[/URL]

I would urge you to read this study [just click on the green letters above] and see what the Marian agenda is--

How can we escape deception, when it is SO CLOSE to the truth?

Afterall-- a counterfeit seeks with everything available to be as close to the real as possible--

A time is coming when we can not depend on our senses for our senses will be OVERWHELMED!

dedication · Posted: Sun Feb 29, 2004 6:55 pm Post subject:

One last thought--

Good can be brought from this as it does focus people's minds on the greatest sacrifice ever made for our redemption.

I will include this "advertisement" that was sent to me and I'd like to pass it on, and hope the administrator won't mind.
But we can sit and moan over the film or we can get out and plant seeds of truth in an atmosphere that has been tuned in to Christ's sacrifice for us.

dedication · Posted: Wed Mar 03, 2004 2:16 pm Post subject:

Jim Caviezel
Interview with Jim Caviezel
Caviezel who plays the role of Christ in the movie is a devout Roman Catholic. He has credited the Marian apparitions at Medjugorje as his inspiration for taking on the role of Jesus.

Caviezel is reported as saying "I ask Mary to guide me and my career... This film is something that I believe was made by Mary for her Son.”

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The movie is not based solely on the Bible but also on the visions of Roman Catholic nun-mystics St. Anne Catherine Emmerich and Mary of Agreda. Gibson obtained the writings of these mystics when he purchased the library of a closed nunnery.

Of the visions of Emmerich, Gibson said, “She supplied me with stuff I never would have thought of” (The New Yorker, Sept. 15, 2003).

dedication · Posted: Wed Mar 03, 2004 2:25 pm Post subject:

From the Catholic book: "The Thunder of Justice; The Warning, The Miracle, The Chastisemen, The Era of Peace"

If you look in the chapter called "God's World-Wide Awakening" you will came upon this interesting passage describing some of the Marian predictions-- pages 318-319.

dedication · Posted: Wed Mar 03, 2004 2:35 pm Post subject:

Like I wrote in my study
The Real and the Counterfeit the book "Thunder of Justice" has to do with a virtual explosion of reported apparitions of Mary, the Mother of Jesus all over the world. The messages that these apparitions are giving have to do with the end of the world. As I read the book I was astonished at how easy it would be to be deceived by the events that are predicted.

The counterfeit closely resembles the real in the beginning.

A counterfeit attempts to imitate something of value as closely as it possibly can in order to be recognized as the real thing.
However, though the counterfeit LOOKS and feels like the real thing---it is deceptive --pretending to be the object of value in an effort to mislead, and if a person is deceived thereby they are robbed of the real thing.

There is only ONE WAY that the ultimate impersonation of Christ will be accepted by Christians, and that is if they think it's the real Christ.

When I first read that all these mystics and visionaries, who were communicating with apparitions of "mary" were predicting a stunning, overwhelming, revelation of the cross-- I was aghast.

How could a created being who was asking people to pray to "her" and consecrate themselves to "her" and who was usurping all the roles of Christ as far as mediation, and reconciling, and gaining the victory over the dragon--- yet be prophesying this great revelation of the cross?

That Christ was willing to go to the cross for us, is the supreme act of love by our Savior! There is no question about that. That is CENTRAL and the only means by which sinners are saved.

But, why would this "apparition" [who is not mary at all] but one who seeks for himself, the honor and worship due only to Christ, in mary's name, why would he still promote Christ's supreme act of love?

Yet, consider, how could a counterfeit be a counterfeit if it didn't incorborate the main characteristic of the true?

Yet, if you read more of the book you will find that "mary" pictures Christ's death as "an appeasement" to an offended Father--
She and Jesus are constantly calming down the Father with their appeasements.

This "mary" is constantly promoting the idea that people, even little children, should be willing to suffer to appease the offended Father and lessen the purgatory of sinners, etc. This apparition is NOT presenting the gospel correctly.

BUT the Bible says:

"FOR GOD SO LOVED THE WORLD,
that He gave His Son...that we could have eternal life.
"The Father Himself loves us!"

If you keep reading in that book "Thunder of Justice" with it's marian message, you will see that-- if "mary" is allowed to have her way, what appears to be the cross, with "Christ" bleeding upon it, will appear in the sky, with considerable physical and emotional phenomena.

Who knows-- maybe God in His mercy will not allow such a counterfeiting of His symbol of mercy and love to be displayed in the skies, with the deceptive agenda of the marian message-- with it's aim to drive all people into the Papal fold,---
so "mary" has turned to the movie screen to fulfil her predictions.

dedication · Posted: Fri Mar 05, 2004 3:33 pm Post subject:

The film is teaching the CATHOLIC GOSPEL

The gospel that God is a sadistic God that must be appeased by making people suffer.

It was not the brutality heaped upon Jesus that saved us.
Many people have suffered as much if we look only upon the physical pain.
Ty Gibson [not to be confused with Mel Gibson] in his book "Seeing with new eyes" tells of his conversation with a follower of a new age guru. Apparently this person's guru, who the devotee discribed as filled with love and goodness, had been seized by the followers of an opposing guru, stripped and tied and then with hot tongs they plucked out pieces of his flesh over many hours till his legs and arms were gone and finally they started plucking his inner organs till finally he died.

The new ager felt his "master" had suffered far more then Christ and was therefore much more qualified to be the savior .

No, it is not the physical brutality that saved us--

The biggest crushing that took Christ's life was the load of sin which he took upon Himself-- our sins, our transgressions-- which separated Him from the Father-- the agony of the eternal separation, which He could not, in those last moments upon the cross, when He cried out "My God, my God why have you forsaken me," see through as being anything less then eternal.

That is the death he has saved us from so we can have eternal life if we accept HIM.

That the wages of sin is death is CORRECT--
Christ took upon HIMSELF our sins and suffered the withdrawal of His Father, and had to die the death of lost sinner, in order that we could be redeemed. His shed blood IS OUR salvation.

2 Cor. 5.21
For he has made him to be sin for us, who knew no sin; that we might be made the righteousness of God in him.
Galatians 3.13
Christ has redeemed us from the curse of the law, being made a curse for us: for it is written, Cursed is every one that hangeth on a tree:
1 Peter 2.24
Who his own self bare our sins in his own body on the tree, that we, being dead to sins, should live unto righteousness: by whose stripes ye were healed.

But the sheer brutality and violence was Satan's moment of triumph over Christ--
His moment of revenge and fiendish delight in torturing the Son of God.

That is what is now beng glorified on that film--
as some have pointed out-- the brutality of the film exceeds what a body could endure and live, much less be able to get up and walk carrying a heavy cross--
The film seems to take extra sadistic measures to re-torture the Son of God.

The cruelity conjured up by Satan against his Creator, is what forever convinced the heavenly hosts of the utter hatred satan had for his Creator. By the raw cruelity against Christ, whom he knew perfectly well was the Son of God, satan uprooted himself from the last sympathies of the heavenly beings forever. (cp Rev. 12)

The violent brutality was not from God, it was satan's hatred displayed against Christ. By taking OUR SINS, Christ was separated from the Father and satan was given free reign.

Is. 59.2
But your iniquities have separated between you and your God, and your sins have hid his face from you, that he will not hear.

The Father suffered with Christ in all His humiliation and agony. He suffered as He saw the Son of His love despised and rejected by those whom He came to elevate, ennoble, and save. He saw Him hanging upon the cross, mocked and jeered by the passers-by, but He hid as it were His face from Him for Christ was bearing the sin of the world, the dying in the sinner's stead. The human heart knows the love of a parent for his child. But never can the heart of man fathom the depths of God's agony as He had to turn away from His Son.

The main part of Christ's sacrifice WAS

1. The taking upon Himself our sins (and there are many verses that tell He did this.

2. Dying (now you ASSUME He had a guaranteed "happy ending")
That however, is an assumption the Christian world is promoting-- BUT IT'S NOT TRUE-- one of the reasons satan was so violent and brutal against Christ was because he, satan, KNEW that if he could get Christ to sin-- he, satan, would have won and the plan of salvation would have been defeated.

3. His resurrection

4. His exaltation in the heavenly sanctuary as our Priest and the one declared worthy to implement the covenant of salvation.
(Hebrews, Rev. 4 and 5 and others)

The gory brutality and violence was satan's hatred and satan's doing, not God's purpose. Christ could have died a far less brutal death and still supplied the blood for our atonement.

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dedication · Posted: Fri Mar 05, 2004 3:44 pm Post subject:

Protestants are proclaiming this film to be "the gospel"---

On some forums, to speak against this film is to be accused of speaking against Christ's gospel, and it is implied that since this film is the Divinely inspired means to present the gospel to the world, therefore one has rejected Christ and the gospel message.

Most do not realize that the final beastly power spoken of in Revelation is not secular humanism, BUT AN APOSTATE CHRISTIANITY. Romanist Christianity and Apostate Protestantism joining hands with Spiritualism.

The popularity of the film is disturbing BECAUSE protestant American preachers and spiritual leaders are embracing the Marian inspired, Catholic gospel focused on the violence and brutality inflicted, as the ultimate revelation of the true gospel!

This is a major step toward bringing all under the primacy of the papacy.

What can we do?

NO WE SHOULD NOT TELL PEOPLE TO GO see it,

But thousands are going and we should be out their giving the true gospel
-- handing out the book Desire of Ages etc. etc.

dedication · Posted: Sun Mar 07, 2004 1:20 am Post subject:

Mariology in the Film Itself

The following I have gleaned from reviews given by people who have seen the film. I myself have not, and do not intend to view this film.

The first from Bacchiocchi's Endtime News letter #112

"The most glaring heresy of The Passion is the prominent role
that Mary plays throughout the film as a partner with Christ in the
redemption of mankind. She lends vital support to her Son
throughout the whole ordeal. In accordance with Catholic belief, had
she been absent, Christ would not have been able to offer Himself as
the sacrifice for mankind. This heresy is taught especially by Ann
Catherine Emmerich who presents Mary as co-redemptrix, that is,
co-redeemer. At the time of the crucifixion Mary actually utters the
words: "Let me die with you."

While in the Bible Mary appears only once in the Gospel of
John when Jesus on the Cross pointing to John says to His mother:
"Woman, behold your son!" (John 19:26),

Yet, in the movie Mary is present in all the major episodes.

She is dressed like a Medieval nun, rather than a first century Jewish woman.

She is present in the Garden to comfort her Son.

She meets Peter on the streets after his denial of Christ. Peter in distress looks Mary on her face and falls on his knees, confessing his sin and asking for her forgiveness. Mary is ready to absolve Peter for his sin, but he jumps up and says, "No, I am not worthy." The Catholic intercessory role of Mary is loud and clear.

Mary appeals to Pilate's wife, Claudia, urging her to
pressure the Roman soldiers to protect her son against the angry
Jewish crowd. Claudia aligns herself with Mary by influencing her
husband on behalf of Christ. But Pilate's efforts are too little and
too late. Again, the interaction between Mary and Claudia is foreign
to the Bible, deriving instead from Gibson's fertile imagination.

Christ's journey along the Via Dolorosa on the way to
Golgotha is inspired not by the Gospels, but by the medieval Catholic
devotional ritual , known as the 14 "Stations of the Cross." During
this journey Christ stops several times because he has no strength
left to go on. At those points, Mary is always near Christ and acts
as His comforter and coach. Through their eyes contact, Mary infuses
mystical power on her Son.

The notion of Mary participating with Christ in our
redemption, is a long-standing Catholic heresy that Protestant have
strongly rejected. But, I dare to predict that the subtle and
deceptive role of Mary in the movie will influence many uninformed
Evangelicals to embrace her as their co-redeemer. This deception is
fostered by the powerful role Mary plays in the movie, especially in
the last scenes.

Mary and Jesus at the Cross

When Jesus hangs on the Cross with His lacerated body covered
with blood, Mary embraces His bloody feet and her face is splattered
with blood. What a powerful Catholic message in showing not only
Jesus bleeding on the Cross, but also Mary standing besides Him,
covered with blood! The message is clear. Both of them have paid the
price of our redemption.

Even more telling is the picture of Mary cradling the bloody
body of Jesus in the same position as Michelangelo's pietà, when the
Roman centurion took the body down from the Cross. That picture has a
powerful message. It shows not only the importance of Christ's death,
but also the sacrifice of Mary in offering her Son for our salvation.

In an interview with Zenit, the Roman Catholic News Service,
Thomas Rosica, the Catholic priest who oversaw World Youth Day 2002
and its Way of the Cross through the streets of Toronto, acknowledges
how The Passion of the Christ highlights the role of Mary: "One
scene, in particular, was very moving. As Jesus falls on the Way of
the Cross, there is a flashback to his falling on a Jerusalem street
as a child, and his mother running out of the house to pick him up.
The interplay of Mary and Jesus in this film is moving, and reaches
its apex in the scene of the Pietà. The Mother of the Lord is
inviting each of us to share her grief and behold her Son." (Father
Thomas Rosica on Mel Gibson's "The Passion," National Director of
World Youth Day 2002 Weighs in on Film, 2004-02-06).

------

Another who saw the movie reports:

In one scene a Roman gurad stops dead in his tracks and looks at Mary, seemingly transfixed, and can't look away for a period of time.
The person who stares transfixed at Mary and asks another who she is.

The disciples also address Mary as "Mother", this, even before Jesus speaks to John about taking care of her just before he dies.

Mary is also portrayed as having a supernatural connection to Jesus, such as in the scene where she is walking down the street, and suddenly senses Jesus is near, she kneels and puts her face to the ground. The camera then pans below street level and shows that Jesus is hanging below in a dungeon by chains. He senses her and it brings him comfort.

Mary is also presented as strengthening Jesus during his walk to Golgotha under the burden of the cross.

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Here's another report by Charles Sabold :

Considering the limited range of Caviezel’s Jesus, one could almost say
that this is more about the Passion of Mary.

It seems that she suffers in some ways as much as He does; He sheds His blood at the scourging, and she cleans it up with white linens from Pilate’s
wife (taken from Catholic legend), participating symbolically in what took place.
She is the rock of strength around which the disciples revolve, and they even call her “Mother.”

When it seems that even Jesus Himself might not be able to make it to
Golgotha with the cross, she is there; they speak briefly, their eyes meet,
and somehow He has the strength to go the rest of the way.

She knows and understands what is taking place, even though the disciples do not.
The story is not just passively oriented on Mary, as some evangelicals
have said; in fact, she is shown to play a critical role, alongside that of
Jesus Himself, in effecting this sacrifice. She is not only the second focus
of the film but the most identifiable character in it; whereas the other
characters are human (or the Devil himself), she has the Godlike
aloofness to see the business through to its conclusion, even though she is emotional and in pain.

There was one very telling moment where the camera is focused on her
crying, but in the unfocused background they are scourging Jesus; Jesus
is hidden behind Mary, though, and it looks like a little Roman is scourging
her heart.

All of this fits into the Catholic picture that Mary suffered as well for us,
and that she redeems us in partnership with Jesus’ Passion (making her co-redemptrix in theological terms). I wouldn’t call this particularly subtle,
but judging from the glowing Protestant reviews I have read, this slipped under a lot of people’s radar.

----

Movie Review
by Frederic and Mary Ann Brussat
But the heart and soul of the film is the performance by Maia Morgenstern as Mary, the mother of Jesus.

---

As Jim Caviezel, the actor portraying Christ, said, "This film is something that I believe was made by Mary for her Son."

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Mariology, I believe, is in direct opposition with the true "spirit of prophecy" for the last days. It will sweep the world into the Papal fold--

While the real mother of Jesus no doubt suffered as any mother would under such circumstances--

The modern marian movement is a deception.--
It is more than a heresy, it is a supernatural power

"We wrestle not against flesh and blood........"

dedication · Posted: Sun Mar 07, 2004 5:15 pm Post subject:

Remember-- Mariology is more than a belief of a group of people. It is a supernatural power appearing as apparitions of Mary and giving messages and demanding the world and all individuals be consecrated to her "immaculate heart".

Mary claims-- "My role as true mother and Co-redemptrix will become manifest to all.....In the end my Immaculate Heart will triumph" (Thunder of Justice page 51)

Has the time come when this impersonation begins gathering, not only the Catholics but also the Protestants under her spell--

It's amazing how Protestantism is promoting this film as the true gospel.

On another front we see the "moral majority" or "christian right" taking over the seats of the USA government---

What's next on the agenda?
The chastisement-- when it will be declared trouble is the result of those who refuse to heed mary's catholic gospel?
Legislation putting an end to religious freedom in the name of making everyone "religious" and "saving the world" from further chastisement?

We are living in awesome times--