The accusation that Ellen White used an occult-powered talisman to make a counterfeit Jesus appear

Chat with distinguished representatives of Spiritualism, Roman Catholicism and apostate Protestantism.
Post Reply
Zog Has-fallen
Seventh-day Shubertian
Seventh-day Shubertian
Posts: 1402
Joined: Fri Feb 21, 2014 8:05 pm

The accusation that Ellen White used an occult-powered talisman to make a counterfeit Jesus appear

Post by Zog Has-fallen » Sat Apr 15, 2017 7:13 pm

The following excerpts are from my encounter with a truly vile Ellen White hating "Orthodox Christian" named Resjudicata that is defended and supported by the administrators of the CARM forum. This thread just copies my original, personal refutation of his accusation that Ellen White had acquired an occult-powered talisman and used it frequently to make a counterfeit Jesus appear.

Exhibit 1

Ellen White's Alleged Subconscious Confession

Soon after this I had another dream. I seemed to be sitting in abject despair, with my face in my hands, reflecting like this: If Jesus were upon earth, I would go to Him, throw myself at His feet, and tell Him all my sufferings. He would not turn away from me; He would have mercy upon me, and I would love and serve Him always. {CET 26.2}

Just then the door opened, and a person of beautiful form and countenance entered. He looked upon me pitifully, and said: "Do you wish to see Jesus? He is here, and you can see Him if you desire it. Take everything you possess, and follow me." {CET 26.3}

I heard this with unspeakable joy, and gladly gathered up all my little possessions, every treasured trinket, and followed my guide. He led me to a steep and apparently frail stairway. As I began to ascend the steps, he cautioned me to keep my eyes fixed upward, lest I should grow dizzy and fall. Many others who were climbing the steep ascent fell before gaining the top. {CET 26.4}

Finally we reached the last step, and stood before a door. Here my guide directed me to leave all the things that I had brought with me. I cheerfully laid them down. He then opened the door, and bade me enter. In a moment I stood before Jesus. There was no mistaking that beautiful countenance; that expression of benevolence and majesty could belong to no other. As His gaze rested upon me, I knew at once that He was acquainted with every circumstance of my life and all my inner thoughts and feelings. {CET 26.5}

I tried to shield myself from His gaze, feeling unable to endure His searching eyes; but He drew near with a smile, and laying His hand upon my head, said, "Fear not." The sound of His sweet voice thrilled my heart with a happiness it had never before experienced. I was too joyful to utter a word, but, overcome with emotion, sank prostrate at His feet. While I was lying helpless there, scenes of beauty and glory passed before me, and I seemed to have reached the safety and peace of heaven. At length my strength returned, and I arose. The loving eyes of Jesus were still upon me, and His smile filled my soul with gladness. His presence awoke in me a holy reverence and an inexpressible love. {CET 27.1}

My guide now opened the door, and we both passed out. He bade me take up again all the things I had left without. This done, he handed me a green cord coiled up closely. This he directed me to place next my heart, and when I wished to see Jesus, take it from my bosom, and stretch it to the utmost. He cautioned me not to let it remain coiled for any length of time, lest it should become knotted and difficult to straighten. I placed the cord near my heart, and joyfully descended the narrow stairs, praising the Lord, and telling all whom I met where they could find Jesus. {CET 27.2}

This dream gave me hope. The green cord represented faith to my mind, and the beauty and simplicity of trusting in God began to dawn upon my soul. {CET 28.1}


Zog Has-fallen
Seventh-day Shubertian
Seventh-day Shubertian
Posts: 1402
Joined: Fri Feb 21, 2014 8:05 pm

Accusations and Arguments

Post by Zog Has-fallen » Sat Apr 15, 2017 7:52 pm

The Prosecutor's Opening Remarks
Resjudicata wrote:Where is the Biblical support for the proposition that Jesus can be summoned like a genie in a bottle via a Green cord? Since the Bible never suggests such a device, is it Occult?
The Prosecutor's Expert Witnesses
Resjudicata wrote:Here's how Satanists would analyze Ellen's Green Cord:

"A Green Cord is traditionally used with 40 knots tied it in to form a witches' ladder. It is used for straightforward autosuggestion." What Witches Do, By Stewart Farrar. [1].

Green Cords play an important role in casting spells on other people in Wiccan Witchcraft: [2].

"If it is difficult for you to image or visualize the color you desire then secure a bit of ribbon of the proper shade, or a drapery of the color you want and look at it until you have the color impressed upon your mind. This will help you to visualize the Cosmic currents, and when you are concentrating you should realize that they are currents of force, though you speak of them in terms of color.”
.....
"Green is the current of individualization. It also represents selfishness both in its higher and its lower forms. Manifesting in this great current is all desire for personal possessions, distinctions and individual aggrandizement. It is the current of intellectualization without intuition." [3].

Green is also the color of Islam: [4].

Ellen's Green Cord vision has both powerful undercurrents of the occult and of course, Adventism's close and growing association with Islam, where it has much more in common than with Christianity.

It gets worse:

"Greening -- single green cord -- This cord represents new growth, the beginning of the learning process and the budding interest of the green Witch in the cuveen and Tradition. The purpose of the ritual is to form a magical link with loose bonds between student and cuveen and to establish the beginning of a learning period of at least three months. The Green Cord serves as a physical reminder of that link. Aside from interested adults coming to the Tradition, children of the curveen are eligible to wear the Green Cord (and thereby to acknowledge their relationship to the Craft of the Family) at the Age of Reason. This cord is cut and burned at the time that a Witch progresses to Adoption." [5].

It turns out that a green cord was a sign of the Prophet Mohammed:

"He gave Mustafsa the long green cord of the prophet to wear around his neck, both to signal the importance of his commission, and to warn him that failure meant he must be hanged - must even hang himself." Culture and Civilization, Volume 1; Volume 2009 edited by Irving Louis Horowitz, P. 90 [6].
The Prosecutor's Conclusion
Resjudicata wrote:Was Ellen’s Green Cord method of summoning Jesus to do her will from God, or from somewhere else? Where in the Bible is there any support for such a tool?

Zog Has-fallen
Seventh-day Shubertian
Seventh-day Shubertian
Posts: 1402
Joined: Fri Feb 21, 2014 8:05 pm

Sister White never claimed to have a magic device to summon Jesus

Post by Zog Has-fallen » Sat Apr 15, 2017 9:34 pm

Resjudicata wrote:
Zog Has-fallen wrote:I have no intention of excusing your angriest slander against God by listening to and laughing at your most ridiculous slander. Instead of pretending to be removing imaginary specks in the eyes of others, why don't you cope with your own overt and unquestionably tremendous blasphemy of cursing God and calling the Father's gospel "putrid and deceptive anti-Christian filth," "poisonous and dishonest filth" and "satanic nonsense"?
So your argument is that Ellen did NOT use a Green Cord? That is what it would take for you to accuse me of slander.

So Ellen lied about having a green cord that she could summons Jesus with? Is that your latest story?
As I've said many times, I Have No Sympathies For The Cult Worship of the god of EGW Denigration. I accept Sister White's beautiful dream for what it says. And I accept Sister White's interpretation: "The green cord represented faith to my mind." And recall that Sister White's writings are replete with the instruction that faith must be exercised.
Resjudicata wrote:Actually she said Jesus would appear if she summonsed him with the Green Cord.

Do you know of other prophets that could order Jesus around like that?
And I'm sure Jesus would appear if Ellen remembered that promise and had the cord with her whenever she was dreaming.
Resjudicata wrote:That is totally occult!

Zog Has-fallen
Seventh-day Shubertian
Seventh-day Shubertian
Posts: 1402
Joined: Fri Feb 21, 2014 8:05 pm

Ellen White's magical green cord found at Elmshaven

Post by Zog Has-fallen » Sat Apr 15, 2017 9:55 pm

Resjudicata wrote:Actually, it wasn't a symbol. It is clear that Ellen said the Green Cord was given to her to summons Jesus whenever she felt the need.
Whenever I'm given tangible valuables in my dreams, they're never literally in my physical possession when I wake up. I wonder if anyone has ever found Ellen's magical green cord laying around somewhere at Elmshaven. Since Resjudicata is such a firm believer in it, I propose that we send him off to St. Helena, California to search for it. He is obviously so desperate to confirm his fantasies, I'm sure that he can find it.

I can see the headlines now: Ellen White's magical green cord found at Elmshaven. Found under Ellen's bed by a superstitious devotee of the occult.
Resjudicata wrote:So you are arguing that Ellen was lying about the Green Cord?
No. I'm suggesting that your name came up in the Investigative Judgment and that you have been sentenced to suffer an irrevocable, terminal madness to the end of your days for willingly believing in the hate-driven fantasies of your own mind.

http://everythingimportant.org/talisman

Post Reply